What a fun last few weeks. Pretty much everyone I voted for, lost. No Ron Paul, No Dino Rossi, and no driving in the carpool lanes. It was a little painful to take, but I am ok. It was a bummer to watch the television knowing that I was observing a train wreck, and there was absolutely nothing I can do to stop it.
One thing that I watched with particular interest, was the passing of proposition 8 in California. It defines marriage as a union between a man and a woman. It passed.
The last few days have got me thinking. I guess because Most of the anti-prop 8 sentiment was directed at my faith. Yeah, I am one of THOSE people. (not the gay ones, the other side.)
Let me start out by saying the typical ignorant thing… I am not anti-homosexual, I have lots of homosexual friends. (good heavens, how many times do I have to read that insane line when I see people defending their views by saying this.) Truth is, I have a few gay friends. I however don’t look at them as my “gay” friends. At least no more than I look at my other friends as my “living with a girl or boy out of wedlock” friends. They are just friends. I don’t have enough friends to be able to afford the luxury of discriminating any of them. Pretty much, if you are nice to me and you don’t suck, you can be my friend.
I am pretty sure all of them know my position on things based solely on the fact that I am a semi-religious person. My religion influences my decision about what my views are. Proposition 8 is one of those times, when I had to take some hard looks at what it is that I believe.
You know what, I don’t grope, molest, grind, or otherwise show excessive affection in public. My wife would never stand for it. When I am at home… well, that is none of your damn business. To be honest, as long as I am not in the next unit from you, I don’t care what you do either. I don’t care of you do it with a male, female, or computer. That is your deal.
Now that I have been married for 10 years (almost)… I also have found that marriage is not always about sex. (Uhm, I will end that conversation in the off chance that my wife reads this blog.) I can’t imagine that it is much different for a homosexual union. They still have dirty dishes (oh so dirty…) and floors that need vacuumed, and toothpaste caps that are left off.
If two people that care about each other want to live together as committed partners, you know, I am cool with that, I really am. Man and woman, woman and woman (if they are hot), man and man (as long as one is a decorator) or whatever. Commitment and kindness is awesome.
I guess that the thing that I struggle with is that my religion views marriage as a sacred thing between a man and a woman. Call it semantics or whatever, but I was kinda hoping, and thinking that the whole marriage thing was something that God put the old stamp of approval on. Of course a homosexual has the right to feel special too. However, since 99% of Christian denominations would agree that Marriage is between a man and a woman, and the majority of voters agree… Can we just call this one? Twice in California, folks have said they want marriage to be defined in this manner.
I promise to fight tooth and nail for you to be able to share health insurance. I think you have the right to listen to Barry White in the bedroom. You can buy a house together, and I will come over to your housewarming party. ( I like Johnsonville brats.) I have a best friend that I love. He is a guy, and I am a guy. (it is the brotherly love kind, not the gee I think you are hot kind.) There was a time in our bachelorhood, that we were chilling together all the time. We talked about all sorts of things, like what we wanted in life, our goals, our aspirations, and what we wanted done when we died. We shared cash when we were broke, and we were joined at the hip. If something had happened to him, I would like to think, that since we were so close, that I would be able to go to the hospital if something happened. I would have liked to think that since I knew so many intimate details, I would have been able to have some input into what happened with him.
You wanna be even more committed to someone of the same sex, I think there should be some sort of validation for you as well. Can we just call it something other than Marriage?
I think I have this justified in my head. It makes sense to me. I understand that someone that wants to call a union between two same sex couples wants to be afforded the same luxury, but you know what, this amazing country, that did NOT vote in Ron Paul, says they are not interested in that. They ayes have it.
I struggle to walk a fine line. "Love your Neighbor as yourself." It doesn’t have any caveats in it that say that you are only supposed to love your neighbor if they are not gay. I am pretty sure it means everyone. On the other hand, I have to teach my daughters about morals and the kind of life that the Lord would have them lead. I also have to fight against the extremist views of people that think that Homosexuality is a worse sin than two hetero folks that live together. Uhm… just in case you are wondering, from a religious point of view…no difference.
I need something that I can use to tell my kids that, this is not something we would encourage. The proper way would be to be married to your spouse of an opposite gender, and then you get to make babies and stuff. I don’t however want my children running around with crucifixes trying to exercise the demons out of people that are homosexual.
So the tough part for me? Well, the conflict is in rectifying and making sense of the fact that the majority of the people in California (and other states) have voted this in for the second time. Now, because I support this amendment I am labeled a racist bigot by the homosexual community.
The same community that thinks that I have been duped by a cult. The same community that is as intolerant of my views as they think that I am of theirs.
I think we are just both missing something here. I think you are wrong, you think I am wrong. Your view is that Marriage is a fundamental right for anyone, I think it should be defined as between a man and a woman. Surely one of us HAS to be wrong.
That is my conflict. That someone here HAS TO BE WRONG. I don’t want it to be me. This is something I built my life around. I go to church 1, sometimes 2 times a week. I live it (sometimes poorly) every day of the week. I advocate for it, and I study to make myself a more informed and aware person. I do this specifically so that I am removed enough to make the right decisions for my family and I don;t get caught up in the emotion of it all and do something stupid like move to some compound in Texas, or drink poisoned Kool-Aid. I don’t drink, and folks like to tease me about it. I walked down the street in a white shirt and tie and had people throw things at me and make rude comments about my lifestyle. I have had people go so far as point guns at me and threaten my life, and I was and still am prayed for nightly by many a Christian friend that is sure that I am on a one way train to hell.
I don’t feel that I need to hide what I am. I should be able to walk proud. I should be able to openly discuss the details of my life with others without the fear of being judged. I should be able to get a job and not worry, that once they find out what my way of life is, that I will lose that job. I just want people to respect me. I can’t send my kid to just any private school. Many that are based on religion have specific classes on mine, and how it is wrong. I have had people screaming in my face, and literally stomping on things that hold sacred… All this and more, and I am not even gay!
Maybe we aren’t all that different. I see your way of life as wrong, but I am totally willing to overlook that aspect of your life and be your friend. I don’t want you to be my token gay friend, I just want you to be my friend.
If you won, and you were rejoicing in the streets, would I feel dejected? Yeah. Believe me… watching Ron Paul get .3% of the votes did a number on my will to live. To be a conservative in a liberal state and watch vote after vote lose, it was a rough night. To feel like my vote was wasted and my voice wasn’t heard was tough. I have to pay taxes and I will have the will of a democratic majority imposed on me. I will grumble plenty, but I will deal with it. I know that in 4 years, I will have the opportunity to get all excited again, and then have my hopes crushed one more time.
I guess I know how you feel a little more than you think. I think we all need to see that the playing field is a little more level than you might think. I promise I am not a bigot. I don’t have enough room in my heart for hate. I would hope that as you hope, pray, or wish that I would be open minded and accepting, that you might do the same for yourself.
If you get to have a homosexual marriage, then am I disgusting if I were to marry more than one wife? (Trust me, one is MORE than enough.. but hypothetically?) If I have to open minded to your way of life, is it going to be ok, that I am a religious conservative, or am I just another narrow minded idiot that is so simple minded that I lower myself to believe in a fallacy created by some gold digging teen that decided to make a church organization for the sole purpose of taking over the world and turning people into fundamentalist wackos?
I have my views, I may not be right, or it may not be your cup of tea, but there were more people that agreed with me. I don’t apologize for democracy, nor do I condone the persecution of you because of your views. Can you say that same about your feelings toward me?
2 responses so far ↓
johnbisceglia // November 11, 2008 at 4:18 am
Simply put – the Mormons have proved with their complete obsession with PROP 8 to be a Tax-Exempt Hate Group.
Heterosexuals – You better wake up. Instead of pondering a cerebral concept like how gays want the “1,138 rights of marriage”, you need to educate yourselves about the CONSEQUENCES when one or more of those 1,138 rights are denied. GOOGLE “Freeheld” or “Tying the Knot”; watch the DVDs. Write it down now.
Your laws HATE us, and we’ve had it! Yes, I did said HATE – I stand by it. Because how else can you explain these 3 realities?:
A police woman loses her life in the line of duty; her wife of 13 years is denied all pension benefits.
A rancher loses his husband of 22 years; his inlaws evict him and try to take the home he built and lived in with his beloved.
A detective spends 25 years risking her own life while protecting society; she has to spend her remaining days on this earth worrying whether her earned pension will be transferred to her wife (while living with terminal cancer).
YES, H-A-T-E. And your silence on this matter is a serious affront to our families’s safety and security. FAMILY – isn’t that a cherished concept in the U.S.A.?
So now after decades of disinterest, some of us in the LGBTI community have AWAKENED. And we will refuse to pay one penny of income tax to the IRS until the government (i.e. – you) decide you WANT our tax dollars as EQUAL CITIZENS.
This ain’t a vote.
This ain’t a debate.
This ain’t a popularity contest.
You will PAY OUR TAXES until we have what your family ALREADY HAS; your apathy is costing you money as you read this.
GAY TAX PROTEST!
jakedandy // November 11, 2008 at 10:28 am
Hey, Thanks for writing such a thoughful dialogue… I can see that you are open minded and interested in sharing thoughts to that people can come to a mutual understanding.
Seriously, did you read the article at ALL? or are you just looking up every blog post out there about proposition 8 and copying and pasting your super intelligent reply?
First of all, I am totally cool with partners being able to be included in pension benefits. THey are your benefits, and as long as nobody has put a gun to your head and forced you to put them in as a beneficiary, let them have it, it was your money to decide where you want it to go.
Got a house you and your buddy built? TOss that sucker in the will and give the whole 100 acre ranch to him. (complete with chaps and spurs, not the kinky kind.)
Pensions, the right to visit them in the hospital, the right to hang out in public, the right to make all the decisions regarding life or death… go for it. I don’t have an issue with it.
If you bothered to read my post, you will see, that my issue is with calling it “marriage.”
So,,, in your brilliance, you are no longer going to pay taxes. You think that your support is down the toilet now? You haven’t thought this out very well, have you?
See, I couldn’t care two craps whether you pay taxes or not. I don;t think there are enough homosexuals out there that will support your cause. Therefore, it won;t be much of a drain on anything.
Even if you were able to rally a group large enough to make anyone take notice, you will do nothing more than piss off everyone else making them dig their heels in deeper. This means you will distance yourself even further from mainstream America. Brilliant move.
Then there is the issue of the government. Ruby Ridge ring a bell for you? Seriously, the IRS beats the crap out of hetero folks when they don’t pay their taxes, what do you think they will do to a gay person? I can only imagine the prison soap jokes now…
There is also this crazy notion of eating, and sleeping. You kinda gotta have money to do that. Assuming you are just going ot quit working, eventually your funds will run out. What then? Foodstamps? Homeless shelters?
You might want to go back to the drawing board on this one.
Thank you though, you are helping your cause immensely. I am am trying to decide what my official view will be. I am struggling because as I am accused of hatred and racism, and pretty much hated by the people that claim I hate them…
I would have given you a hug if you wanted, but, you had to go and do this. Your apathy is costing you support as you read this.